The Serious Side - part 2

Ragnar wrote:What's ilegal and should rile you all up more is the extensive pay to play scheme of the Clinton Foundation...of which donations have largely dried up since she lost....as the Clintons favored brutal regimes and dictators over the democracies and human rights they...and George...claim to support including but not limited to Qatar, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia.  If putting American security and lives above the ideologies of these people is "scary" to you, perhaps you're part of the problem?   We dodged a HUGE bullet with Hillary's loss. One only need to see the petulant adolescent temper tantrums Obama is throwing on his way out to see how lucky we got.

Who are you? My goodness... I read a lot about this, however was not sure if it was true.

Ladybug - Please don't fall for everything you read (even on COH) just because the person posting says they know the truth. Check it out. Google the Clinton Foundation and the Trump Foundation. Find out for yourself!

Whether or not the Clinton Foundation offered donors access to members of our government doesn't matter now. A. She was only Secretary of State and there was a limit to what she could do. B. She lost.

When you talk about "pay for play", consider that Trump's sons appear to be offering access to Trump to people they do business with and he's going to be President! That's illegal!

Ragnar--please tell me how the so-called "Clinton pay-to-play" is any different than the president-elect selling tickets to his new year's eve party?  Or folks renting a room at Trump DC? Or any one of thousands of other conflicts of interest --where the family benefits financially and not just by granting access--the Trumps have?  If you think Trump administration will end paying for access to politicians, pay attention over the next 4 years.

LizzyNY wrote:Ladybug - Please don't fall for everything you read (even on COH) just because the person posting says they know the truth. Check it out. Google the Clinton Foundation and the Trump Foundation. Find out for yourself!

Whether or not the Clinton Foundation offered donors access to members of our government doesn't matter now. A. She was only Secretary of State and there was a limit to what she could do. B. She lost.

When you talk about "pay for play", consider that Trump's sons appear to be offering access to Trump to people they do business with and he's going to be President! That's illegal!

Lizzy what part of "I'm not sure if it was true" do you not understand?

ladybugcngc wrote:Lizzy what part of "I'm not sure if it was true" do you not understand?

The "I wasn't sure if it was true" that makes it sound like now you are. Silly me!

LizzyNY wrote:

ladybugcngc wrote:Lizzy what part of "I'm not sure if it was true" do you not understand?

The "I wasn't sure if it was true" that makes it sound like now you are. Silly me!

Interesting...

Trump loves money and being president will not stop him from getting it any way he sees fit. Which means I hope impeachment very soon.

Yep Annemarie.  Trump before becoming President is  teetering on the line of what is acceptable presidential behavior by ridiculing our national security intelligence.  Not to mention his flattering remarks about Putin and giving equal weight to the Assange statements versus our own national security intelligence.  

Ragnar, still waiting for you to provide the source claiming that the Clinton Foundation funds are drying up.  And please provide the link to the story of the evidence of actual pay for play accusations made here.

Vice President Biden has said to Donald Dumb grow up time to be an adult your President.

I don't see that happening .

annemarie wrote:Vice President Biden has said to Donald Dumb grow up time to be an adult your President.

I don't see that happening .

You got that right!  Too bad.  Biden is a wise man.  Any reasonable person about to take the office of the Presidency would be smart to heed his advice. But that's not The Donald.

Just as a matter of interest does anybody know just how much money Donald Trump owes to Russia and the Bank of China?

party animal - not! wrote:Just as a matter of interest does anybody know just how much money Donald Trump owes to Russia and the Bank of China?

No, how much?

I don't think anyone really knows. He'd have to release his tax records and the records for all his businesses which might have had dealings with Russia.Are wealthy Russians invested in his businesses? To what extent? Has he been loaned money by wealthy Russian citizens or Russian banks, or the Russian government?

Unless he opens his books to the public (fat chance!) it will take a lot of really smart people a while to figure out how invested he is in Russia and how indebted he is to the Russians. Does he really think they don't expect something in return?

party animal - not! wrote:Just as a matter of interest does anybody know just how much money Donald Trump owes to Russia and the Bank of China?

PAN, according to The New York Times American companies owned by Trump are in the hole to China for about $650 million.  Not sure how much he is debt to the Russian government but Im sure it's significant.  Unfortunately since the Donald refused to release his tax returns this year we have no idea.

Oops.  Lizzy you and I must have posted at the same time.  But we are on the same page.  

I want to be convinced that Trump or someone close to him wasn't aware of this hacking of the DNC.

So if it turns out that he has no investments in Russia as he says, he's probably up to his **** in debt to them instead. That might explain a few things.....

PAN I misspoke.  Trump is not in debt to just China for the $650 million.  That is approximately how much he's in debt for all his American owned companies.  Don't have better numbers for Russia and China specifically.  Trump has considerable assets in Russia ... according to a statement made by Don Jr.

I subscribe to a newsletter called dailykos.com. There's a post about this topic on there today :"Donald Trump owes $1B to companies "in a potentially powerful position" over the PEOTUS." (dailykos.com/user/Mark Sumner)

Mr. Sumner discusses how Trump helms 516 companies set up in such a way as to give him the best tax breaks possible but make it difficult to know what he owns or owes,

He also notes that there are at least 150 companies like Wells Fargo and MetLife that hold hundreds of millions in loans directly to Trump or to properties partially owned by him. If these companies have regulatory difficulties, how hard would it be for them to blackmail (my word) the president for a favorable outcome by threatening to call in his debt?

This presidency looks to be a real magnet for corruption .

mmm.......if it's not already happening.........govt appointments etc.........


I love Daily Kos

I love Daily Kos too.  I get it everyday and it's always chock full of interesting stories.

Now here's a little something that's worthy of a read.....

http://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/07/us/politics/jared-kushner-trump-business.html?action=click&contentCollection=Briefing&module=Trending&version=Full®ion=Marginalia&pgtype=article

Wow

That was a deep read PAN!  Wow is right.  
This presidency is going to be a nightmare for lawyers and ethics officials.  

Trump will hold his first President-elect press conference on Wednesday (I think) and he is supposedly going to discuss how he will handle his business conflicts-of- interest issues.  We will see.  He makes lots of promises he can't keep.

Trump shows a decided style for governing as an authoritarian.  How will he avoid becoming a kleptocrat if he doesn't separate himself from his real estate business and even his association with his daughter and son-in-law's business and financial ties.

I can tell you one thing.  That 40 some percent who voted for him could care less.  They could also care less that the Russians hacked the DNC and attempted to manipulate the outcome of our presidential election.  Those things disturb me as much if not more than the Trumpster himself!

Donnamarie - A lot of people in our country are having a hard time and see everything through the lens of self-interest. Grasping at straws they bought every lie Trump told them. I can't believe they thought a billionaire (?) and his billionaire friends understand their problems or give a damn about them. IMO They're in for a rude awakening.

I can't wait for them to see the truth, but sadly I don't think they will . He will blame anyone and everyone when he fails and the fools who voted for him will believe him.

Yep Lizzy and annemarie.  If Trump lasts four years it will be a painful realization for his supporters.  I would never wish bad things happening to our country but already before Trump takes the White House I've had so many cringe worthy moments.  I just don't know what to expect.  I can't imagine how our country is going to be better off in four years.

I just watched the Golden Globes (miss George).  Viola Davis (who looked stunning) gave the most amazing introduction to this year's recipient of the DeMille award, Meryl Streep.  I didn't think Meryl could top Viola.  But she did. I hope others here watched and heard her incredible remarks about Hollywood, foreigners, the press and this election.  Bravo Meryl!

Thanks Donna,
I just watched Meryl's speech on youtube, and it was really remarkable, I'm deeply impressed.
'Disrespect creates disrespect!'

If anybody would like to watch it:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NxyGmyEby40

Meryl's speech was so to the point. I had a few tears in my eyes. She touched so many points, and then cslled out the normalising of trump and his bullying, racism, and general hate.

Donald needs to sit down shut up and realize that everyone has a right to their opinion. It will be a long four years if he answers every time someone says something he doesn't like. He needs to worry about the country and running it not about his ego.

Trump attacked Meryl harshly on Twitter:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/818419002548568064
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/818421066859167746
Also this:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/817348644647108609
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/817350726800306177

Sevens,
thanks for the tweets.
It's good to see that others agree with us on the freedom of speech...

And also interesting to see that Trump doesn't seem to have anything to do apart from tweeting around...

Trump tweeted a response to Meryl Streep ... as expected.  This is what we can always predict about Trump.  He is totally insecure and cannot stand to be challenged by anyone.  He makes a fool of himself.

What is sad is neither he or his people seem to realize how many  people hate him. He needs to accept peoples right to free speech and get on with doing his job. I won' use the title just can't do it.

I just saw a tweet by one of our best satirical magazines:

https://mobile.twitter.com/extra3/status/818446649538265088

"Reconciliation on a film set: Meryl Streep and Donald Trump will shoot a movie together. It's called 'The Devil Wears Toupee' "

I like this humour

  Me too

Trump supporters are whining how millionaire celebs should shut up about politics, when they elected a millionaire celebrity as the President of their own country.

Can't make this ish up.

Nope you can't make it up and if it were brought to their attention they would probably say he is different.

Well, Donald dumb said that boutiques are selling out of dresses for the inauguration and that of course his will be
an record setting inauguration. The only problem is there is no sell out most boutiques have plenty of dresses and there has been no big interest in gowns for this event. There less interest than at any other inauguration.
You are going to run the country why the hell are you talking about dresses. He is just a fool.

I really believe "We the People" wealthy or low/middle income, republican or democrat, liberal or conservative, old or young, male or female, all ethnicities… can work together to hold our elected officials (both republican and democrat) responsible and accountable to things WE ALL agree on. 
 
We have a new President, he does not work alone.  We can take all this anti-Trump energy, put into constructive ideas, and hold our elected officials responsible and accountable to things we all agree are important:  the economy, education, healthcare…
 
I’ve written Sen. Schumer about my ISIS/IS concerns with constructive ideas I think will help. I know Lizzy is concerned about education, Annemarie is concerned about women rights, Donna is concerned laws mandated by the Supreme Court, just to name a few. 
 
Intelligent people blog here why not put the energy (if you haven't already) into constructive ideas and over the next four years hold our elected officials accountable to what is important to ALL of us.

Excellent suggestion, Ladybug.

My problem is I have a thing for the "dumb fool at the back of the class"...... I want him to prove the beautiful kids wrong....I want him to be the hero at the end of the movie.....

I want him to go high, prove martial arts are just that, ballet with control.....but I think the Senior just did that by inviting M. Streep to a final.... in case your not aware she went low there....

People of the people by the people are easily offended ....You don't have to be an award winning actress.... you can equally be an award winning Martial Arts Master to know that....

Meryl Streep is a citizen of the U.S. just like me.  And she chose to use her acceptance speech to speak against what has happened during this election.  She obviously feels passionate and wanted to share her feelings.  Unlike other presidential elections in our country this one has been devasting in a way that no other Democrat/Republican contest has been in recent memory ... maybe ever.    Streep didn't go low.  This isn't about a Democrat whose candidate lost and a Republican is going to be President. Its not about policy differences.  It is about this particular election and this particular candidate who attacked our democracy.  He used hateful and divisiveness comments to reach out to his supporters. He has lied incessantly.

Lots of ordinary people HAVE spoken out against this man.  Lots of politicians have too.  Everyone who believes in our democratic government should be using any platform they can to speak out against this man.

I don't want Trump to succeed.  If he does it gives a pass to his incredibly insulting and hateful rhetoric that we heard from him during the campaign.  He is hardly someone who I would want my children to aspire to.  He is really a lowly human being.

Donnamarie wrote:Meryl Streep is a citizen of the U.S. just like me.  And she chose to use her acceptance speech to speak against what has happened during this election.  She obviously feels passionate and wanted to share her feelings.  Unlike other presidential elections in our country this one has been devasting in a way that no other Democrat/Republican contest has been in recent memory ... maybe ever.    Streep didn't go low.  This isn't about a Democrat whose candidate lost and a Republican is going to be President. Its not about policy differences.  It is about this particular election and this particular candidate who attacked our democracy.  He used hateful and divisiveness comments to reach out to his supporters. He has lied incessantly.

Lots of ordinary people HAVE spoken out against this man.  Lots of politicians have too.  Everyone who believes in our democratic government should be using any platform they can to speak out against this man.

I don't want Trump to succeed.  If he does it gives a pass to his incredibly insulting and hateful rhetoric that we heard from him during the campaign.  He is hardly someone who I would want my children to aspire to.  He is really a lowly human being.

If something happens to Trump, will you be happy with Pence as President?

I think what pisses off her critics most is that deep down they know she's right. They have acted out of self interest and done something that, if they are honest with themselves, makes them ashamed. What makes me ashamed is that they can bury that shame down deep and continue on as if everything's fine. Sad.

LizzyNY wrote:I think what pisses off her critics most is that deep down they know she's right. They have acted out of self interest and done something that, if they are honest with themselves, makes them ashamed. What makes me ashamed is that they can bury that shame down deep and continue on as if everything's fine. Sad.

Her critics, are you talking about Merly Streep's critics?  Who acted out of self interest?  Who's ashamed?

So this article says it all really

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/jan/09/meryl-streep-trump-big-weakness-golden-globes-speech

So of course today the manfant has been throwing his toys out of his pram via twitter instead of acting like a man with the biggest responsibilities in the world on his shoulders.......

I bet Pence is just waiting for Donald dumb to screw up so he can take over. When Trump got upset after the theater incident, Pence said it didn't bother him. He contradicted the almost head of the country. We see who acted like an adult in this instance.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/celebrities/clooney-hopes-trump-presidency-wont-spawn-terrible-things/2017/01/09/1700fc12-d6c0-11e6-a0e6-d502d6751bc8_story.html?utm_term=.ef786717847c

http://deadline.com/2017/01/meryl-streep-golden-globes-speech-george-clooney-donald-trump-1201881858/

Exceptional!!!

http://www.miaopai.com/show/omRlvuoGvrfzPwdCOjnv2g__.htm
This is interesting...Trump met with Jack Ma discussing about small business. 
Highly doubt that before Trump meets with our president and addresses many of the political controversies he recently provoked about Taiwan, the South China Sea or North Kocrea etc, we could build any grounds for any sort of "small business" trades between the US and China. President Xi is very tough on those issues and has been determined to recapture Taiwan, and there's at least of 50% of products being sold on Jack Ma's Alibaba platforms are fake, poorly quality ones, with almost free delivery. It's definitely a double-edged sword, and I'm not sure whether Trump and the Americans could realize the reality here. We pay the delivery man much, much lower with more hours to extra work&very little if any bonus.

A bit more than an a guesstimate of what the Manfant owes..........

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/donald-trump-businesses-owe-debt-18-billion-150-institutions-study-source-of-study-president-elect-a7512586.html