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The Serious Side

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by party animal - not! on Wed Oct 19 2016, 00:40

As an observer, to me it is tragic that Obama has been unable, no matter how hard he's tried, to get any form of gun law reform (for all the reasons that we know including a high level of corruption on the part of the NRA).

So that anyone at all, the insane, those with a grudge, those with terrorism on their mind, or even just the trigger happy, can wander into Walmart and buy a deadly weapon just as easily as their cereals and meat it appears..........thus causing massive over reaction in communities, including in some places, the police.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by LizzyNY on Wed Oct 19 2016, 00:43

Ladybug - This is not the place for me or anyone else to tell you what Jesus would do. If you don't already know, then perhaps you need to re-examine your religious affiliation.

Besides the Golden Rule, one adage that comes to mind, though, is "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."

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Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 01:00

fava wrote:Ladybug, I find it objectionable when you state "Syrians seek to murder people," when that blanket statement is not true of the vast majority of Syrians (or Muslims for that matter).  Your inclusion of violent jihad as a core muslim value is like saying the inquisition was indicative of core Christian values.
Fava please give my quote where I state Syrians seek to murder people.  IS/ISIS is an established group with jihad as a core value, based in Syria and surrounding countries.  The problem we face TODAY is: any Muslim could be a member of ISIS/IS; they hide in plain sight and lay in wait to carry out mass murder.  Jihad is a part of Islam; ISIS/IS has taken that belief to the extreme. Christians-Bible Believers do not have the Biblical right, Biblical grace, Biblical flexibility to impose violence to execute moral judgment. imposed violence is NOT a core Biblical value.

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Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 01:23

LizzyNY wrote:Ladybug - This is not the place for me or anyone else to tell you what Jesus would do. If you don't already know, then perhaps you need to re-examine your religious affiliation.

Besides the Golden Rule, one adage that comes to mind, though, is "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."
Lizzy I see the question "what would Jesus do?" was pose in order for me to search myself.  I don't know what you think I've written here that contradicts Biblical standards regarding Bible Believers.  What I've written here is my stand, what I understand to be consistent with Biblical Standards.

"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone"  I'm not judging anyone's sin.  I don't know what I've written here that reflects I'm judging someone's sin;  that is not my intent.  A homicide was committed in San Bernardino those responsible died in a gun fight with police.  How would you define the actions of those responsible for the murder and attempted murder in the San Bernardino case.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by Donnamarie on Wed Oct 19 2016, 03:29

party animal - not! wrote:As an observer, to me it is tragic that Obama has been unable, no matter how hard he's tried, to get any form of gun law reform (for all the reasons that we know including a high level of corruption on the part of the NRA).

So that anyone at all, the insane, those with a grudge, those with terrorism on their mind, or even just the trigger happy, can wander into Walmart and buy a deadly weapon just as easily as their cereals and meat it appears..........thus causing massive over reaction in communities, including in some places, the police.


Absolutely PAN. Even though the crime rate has gone down in our country gun violence is still a huge problem. There are more guns in our country than the total population. I worry far more about vengeful or unstable people walking into a mall or any public area and reeking violence with a semi automatic than the possibility of an international terrorist attack. If Hillary gets elected and we can appoint a Supreme Court justice who might be sympathetic to reforming the 2nd Amendment we may have a slim chance of taking a small step to curtailing the sale of certain types of guns.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by Ramona_ on Wed Oct 19 2016, 05:21

Let the Syrian refugees come to Holland. We will take care of them. We will support them in their needs until it's safe for them to go back to their country.

The general intelligence and security service have lists of names of people who are part of IS/ISIS. And the ones who have comitted terrorist attacks already lived in europe, no refugees.

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Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 05:33

Ramona_ wrote:Let the Syrian refugees come to Holland. We will take care of them. We will support them in their needs until it's safe for them to go back to their country.

The general intelligence and security service have lists of names of people who are part of IS/ISIS. And the ones who have comitted terrorist attacks already lived in europe, no refugees.

Very good to know.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by LizzyNY on Wed Oct 19 2016, 12:39

Ladybug - I'm sorry you are so afraid of terrorism that it has caused you to lose your compassion and condemn a whole people out of hand. Just as in our country there are millions of good decent people for each crazed gunman who commits mass murder, there are millions of good decent Muslims.

I wish there was a way to reassure you that you are safer than you think you are, but there isn't. The world has always been a dangerous place. We can only make it better by working together to help each other.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by party animal - not! on Wed Oct 19 2016, 13:46

We are extremely fortunate to live in democracies where freedom of thought and speech are respected rather than some areas of the world where those freedoms are demonised.

We are also very lucky to live in countries where we are protected by brilliant hardworking security forces.  

The US is one of the leaders of the world in this, and its knowledge and security is acknowledged worldwide.

Unfortunately in some parts, and even though well protected, hysteria and over reaction takes over. 

Perhaps we need to consider and think about those who are not so fortunate but have found themselves living under the direst of regimes in parts of the world we could not even contemplate.

I for one wholehearted and totally respect the work they do and I have no idea how any of them manage to sleep at night quite honestly!

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by fava on Wed Oct 19 2016, 14:01

ladybugcngc wrote:Finding countries where Syrians don't seek to murder the people just for the hell of it, countries that share their core values (including jihad) is a good solution for all.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by Donnamarie on Wed Oct 19 2016, 14:09

It was reassuring to read here so many strong and supportive comments on the Syrian refugee issue.

Fear mongering should never be a factor in compromising the values of our country.


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Re: The Serious Side

Post by party animal - not! on Wed Oct 19 2016, 14:29

Not sure that this has had enough coverage!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/video_and_audio/headlines/37698335

And this will lighten things up a bit!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/video_and_audio/headlines/37706836

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 14:40

I'm speaking out against skilled shooters who go around murdering people just for the hell of it.  Obviously I do not fear them.  For any system of government to bring people from a region the has proven to be hostile to the citizens of their country is UNTHINKABLE.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by annemarie on Wed Oct 19 2016, 14:44

Ladybug, you said  Syrians , that is saying all of them want to murder people and that they all believe in Jihad , that is not the case. Have you spoken to all Syrians?

What countries do you know of that all have the same beliefs and core values. I don't believe there is any
one country where all people believe and feel the same on everything.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by carolhathaway on Wed Oct 19 2016, 14:45

In Germany we have a right-wing group which questions that Germany is a legitimate state and doubts our constitution and laws. Our governments often have problems with them, because they also don't accept our police, make their own driving-licenses etc., but on the other hand use the infrastructure, send their kids to school and accept any financial support or health insurance.
Today one of them shot two police officers who wanted to control if he kept his weapons (which he owned legally) locked and unloaded. Obviously he didn't.

At the weekend a man killed his wife and his two kids before he committed suicide.

Are we really any better than any terrorist? There are fanatics everywhere, in every country, society and religion. 

I've said it a few times:
When I was a kid, we had terrorists who wanted to fight our government and shot politicians and businessmen. I remember when we visited our British twin town in the 1980s and wanted to go to London, we first called the London police in the morning to find out if it was safe  to go there at all and if it was, where it would be safe to go in London due to the IRA. I lived about 20 miles away from the border between East and West Germany, which means, about 20 miles away from the interface between the NATO and the Warsaw Pact and knew that we'd be the first who'd be blown away, if somebody in Moscow or Washington would have decided to start a war. At school we watched movies like 'The Day After' and read books about life after an atomic bomb had exploded accidently. I was on board of the 'Heral of Free Enterprise' just a few days before it sunk.

Actually, I grew up that there's no absolute safety in life. We'll never know if we survived an incident because somebody decides not to bomb it - or maybe just not to pass a red traffic light. It's our decision not to go to street parties, shopping centers or festivals because there might be a suicide bomber. Not to enter a plane because somebody might hijack it. Not to leave the house because a car might catch you. To walk in fear or to say: "F... you, I'm not going to let anybody else control my life!"

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by What Would He Say on Wed Oct 19 2016, 14:47

Talking of Trump....has the Jim Carey story made much of a splash in the U.S.......

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by carolhathaway on Wed Oct 19 2016, 14:53

ladybugcngc wrote:I'm speaking out against skilled shooters who go around murdering people just for the hell of it.  Obviously I do not fear them.  For any system of government to bring people from a region the has proven to be hostile to the citizens of their country is UNTHINKABLE.
Okay, so there never were rampages in the States, where somebody went to a public place with guns, because he just wanted to kill others? Because then, no other country should allow Americans to move to their country. Since there have been Americans before who'd shot people just because they wanted to kill others, and who knows if not all Americans are like that. Christians have been on crusades hundreds of years ago and wanted to christian indigenes. So who knows if not all christians are like that, let's close our country for them.
UNTHINKABLE?

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by annemarie on Wed Oct 19 2016, 14:56

It's been in the papers here.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by annemarie on Wed Oct 19 2016, 15:04

Who or what will Trump blame the protests on, women's hormones or are they being paid by Hillary to protest?

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by What Would He Say on Wed Oct 19 2016, 15:29

He kind of blames Hillary for everything....

No doubt about it....America, you are becoming a bit of a worry to us all....

Neither are perfect....With Hillary at least you can rely on her to take her med's.....the Don not so much, I fear he hasn't kept up with his meds for over a year.....

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by annemarie on Wed Oct 19 2016, 15:37

I don't think he has ever taken them , he probably flushes them when no one's looking.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by What Would He Say on Wed Oct 19 2016, 15:37

I know it sounds weird but.... I just wish Hillary would come out tonight wearing a crisp white shirt, sleeves rolled up to elbow, black pants and a pearl necklace (small)....Hair behind her ears, looking like she is going to do serious business ....

I think she would throw him.... and win heart's if she looked more like a capable *Boss Lady/Mum....and less like Mao Tse Tung....

America need's a Mother....


*think Meryl...In Devil Wear's Prada....

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by LizzyNY on Wed Oct 19 2016, 17:24

WWHS - I don't care what she wears. I just want her (or anyone) to tell him to shut the f**k up until he can say something that actually makes sense and isn't a lie! (Personally, I think hell will freeze over first!)

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Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 17:29

annemarie wrote:Ladybug, you said  Syrians , that is saying all of them want to murder people and that they all believe in Jihad , that is not the case. Have you spoken to all Syrians?

What countries do you know of that all have the same beliefs and core values. I don't believe there is any
one country where all people believe and feel the same on everything.

ISIS/IS is a Syrian murderous network that believes in jihad.  Because they hide in plain sight, we can’t distinguish which Syrian is with the murderous network.  I referenced Syrian as a whole for that reason.  Jihad is a part of Islam, therefore any Muslim at any time can make the decision to be a jihadist.


We are talking about Syrian refugees here.  What I do know is ISIS/IS an established Syrian murderous network that has claimed responsibility for mass murder in the United States.   Understanding neither you nor I can tell the difference between a Syrian refugee and a member of ISIS why would our government bring 10,000 Syrian refugees here?


Syria is a primarily Muslim country; there are other countries that share their common religious beliefs (jihad is a part of Islam that some have taken to the extreme).  Our Constitution under freedom of religion does not extend the right to murder as a method to avenge what one perceives to be unholy, unrighteous, or unjust.  Placing Syrians refugees in countries that share their same”core” religious beliefs are a better fit.  


Last edited by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 18:19; edited 1 time in total

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 17:31

Carol:  Okay, so there never were rampages in the States, where somebody went to a public place with guns, because he just wanted to kill others? Because then, no other country should allow Americans to move to their country. Since there have been Americans before who'd shot people just because they wanted to kill others, and who knows if not all Americans are like that. Christians have been on crusades hundreds of years ago and wanted to christian indigenes. So who knows if not all christians are like that, let's close our country for them.UNTHINKABLE?


My response:  Syrian refugees seem to be a great fit in your country.  Ramona has stated Holland has been a good fit for Syrian refugees.  There are places across the globe where ISIS/IS has not claim responsibility for MASS MURDER.  Placing Syrian refugees in those countries would be a better fit (IMO)

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 17:32

My Position:  Both Saddam Husain and Osama bin Ladan were United States allies at one time, both turned out to be foes.  To bring refugees from a country and/or region that has shown hostility and claimed responsibility for MASS MURDER is UNTHINKABLE. 



Others have the choice to agree or agree to disagree with me.

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Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 17:47

What Would He Say wrote:I know it sounds weird but.... I just wish Hillary would come out tonight wearing a crisp white shirt, sleeves rolled up to elbow, black pants and a pearl necklace (small)....Hair behind her ears, looking like she is going to do serious business ....

I think she would throw him.... and win heart's if she looked more like a capable *Boss Lady/Mum....and less like Mao Tse Tung....

America need's a Mother....


*think Meryl...In Devil Wear's Prada....

Interesting

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by Way2Old4Dis on Wed Oct 19 2016, 18:35

ladybugs, it does not help your assertions at all that you are using the popularly accepted and sensationalized concepts of Islam and jihad to support your claims and opinions, rather than the true meanings.

Any so-called Muslim who uses terror to advance their supposedly religious cause is not following Islam and the teachings of Muhammad. It is flat-out wrong to call a person of true Islamic faith a potential terrorist, no matter where they are from. It's as simple as that.

Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs, but not their own facts.

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Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 18:53

Way2Old4Dis wrote:ladybugs, it does not help your assertions at all that you are using the popularly accepted and sensationalized concepts of Islam and jihad to support your claims and opinions, rather than the true meanings.

Any so-called Muslim who uses terror to advance their supposedly religious cause is not following Islam and the teachings of Muhammad. It is flat-out wrong to call a person of true Islamic faith a potential terrorist, no matter where they are from. It's as simple as that.

Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs, but not their own facts.

Explain that to ISIS/IS.

I have not called anyone a potential terrorist.  I have not labeled ISIS as terrorist.  I define ISIS/IS as twisted wicked evildoers who believe they have been called by to god to avenge what they perceive to be unholy, unrighteous, unjust.

I stand corrected, if I'm wrong when I say any Muslim has the choice to impose jihad.

I do think it was unfair of me to use this forum to ask the question regarding your sister.  I do apologize.

I do stand firm on my positions here.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by LizzyNY on Wed Oct 19 2016, 20:39

Ladybug - I don't want to argue with you, but don't you see that if you carry your thoughts to their logical conclusion we would have had to ban millions of people from our country. Are all Italians in the Mafia? Are all Russians in the Russian mafia? Are all Chinese tong members? Are all Germans nazis? There isn't a group on earth that doesn't have members of that group who are criminal and murderous - and you can't tell them apart from the rest,either. But the whole group isn't criminal.

People who immigrated here have made huge contributions to this country - unless, of course, you are one of the first people (Native American) who probably feel that everyone who came here just f**ked their country up.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 20:52

Lizzy - You are not hearing me.  I have not said I wanted to "ban" any group.  

We are talking about Syrian refugees here.  What I do know is ISIS/IS an established Syrian murderous network that has claimed responsibility for mass murder in the United States.   Understanding neither you nor I can tell the difference between a Syrian refugee and a member of ISIS why would our government bring 10,000 Syrian refugees here?

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by LizzyNY on Wed Oct 19 2016, 21:51

So you're saying we should ban them?

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by carolhathaway on Wed Oct 19 2016, 21:57

ladybugcngc wrote:What I do know is ISIS/IS an established Syrian murderous network that has claimed responsibility for mass murder in the United States.   Understanding neither you nor I can tell the difference between a Syrian refugee and a member of ISIS why would our government bring 10,000 Syrian refugees here?
Ladybug,
now I understand our different opinions!
ISIS / IS is a terror organization which was founded in Lebanon in 1999, expanded into Syria in 2013 and whose headquarter moved to Syria in 2014. It's located in the whole Middle East and Northern Africa.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_State_of_Iraq_and_the_Levant

So you would have to ban refugees / immigrants from all those countries to come to the States and also make sure that nobody, who lives in the States, radicalizes...

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by carolhathaway on Wed Oct 19 2016, 21:59

Sorry,
you said that you don't want to ban any group, Ladybug. So you just want to stop them from coming to the States.

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ladybugcngc

Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 22:37

Carol, I want to thank your for the background information.  

I don't want our government to bring in 10,000 refugees from a country or region  with an establish murderous network that has committed MASS MURDER in our country.  You view ISIS/IS as a terrorist group.  I view ISIS/IS as a murderous network with twisted/wicked/ criminal ideology.  

I don't seek to ban Syrians or any immigrant from going through the NORMAL channels of immigration.  If I understand correctly, Syrian citizens are caught in the middle of civil and are trying to find refuge.  

My Position: Syria is a primarily Muslim country; there are other countries that share their common religious beliefs (jihad is a part of Islam that some have taken to the extreme).  Placing Syrian refugees in countries that share their same”core” religious beliefs are a better fit.  


Countries in that region have historically been hostile to our country; this solution works for both Syrians who seek refuge as well as protect the citizens of our country.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by party animal - not! on Wed Oct 19 2016, 23:25

Your view is shared by many around the world who also wonder whether many of those who travel are not refugees but economic migrants looking for a better life and jumping on the bandwagon of those in need. 

And it is true that Daesh threatened much, and some burned their fingers rather than have fingerprints taken to achieve their goal. 

But those who seek asylum do have massive security checks before they are accepted in that country - and the USA as I have said is extremely good at that. It has also be said by some that 10,000 refugees being absorbed into the USA's population is not unreasonable provided all those checks are in place. I cannot remember how many muslims are resident in the States already.

One thing that is constantly said is how surprising it is that the countries in the region have not taken more. 

That is highly debatable - Syria is largely made up of Shia muslims, but Saudi Arabia for example is largely Sunni. 

I have no idea how the neighbouring countries of Lebanon and Jordan = so relatively small - are managing to cope with 5 million and 3 and a half million respectively, all of whom have escaped the war.

Thee is some controversy here in the UK tonight as we have agreed to take children from the Calais camp who have relatives here, and they are starting to arrive to be checked through the immigration process before the camp is dismantled. 

Unfortunately some are proving not to be children at all and have lied about their age! 

I'm not too impressed by the fact that they've taken a child's place either.

It's also been pointed out by an Archbishop here that we are not part of Schengen and never were.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by ladybugcngc on Wed Oct 19 2016, 23:47

The security checks do the change the HOSTILE history impose on our nation from that region.  It does not change the truth a Syrian based murderous network claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country.  There are 7 continents and 196 countries surely they have other places they can seek refuge.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by fava on Wed Oct 19 2016, 23:52

ladybugcngc wrote:Carol, I want to thank your for the background information.  

I don't want our government to bring in 10,000 refugees from a country or region  with an establish murderous network that has committed MASS MURDER in our country.  You view ISIS/IS as a terrorist group.  I view ISIS/IS as a murderous network with twisted/wicked/ criminal ideology.  

I don't seek to ban Syrians or any immigrant from going through the NORMAL channels of immigration.  If I understand correctly, Syrian citizens are caught in the middle of civil and are trying to find refuge.  

My Position: Syria is a primarily Muslim country; there are other countries that share their common religious beliefs (jihad is a part of Islam that some have taken to the extreme).  Placing Syrian refugees in countries that share their same”core” religious beliefs are a better fit.  


Countries in that region have historically been hostile to our country; this solution works for both Syrians who seek refuge as well as protect the citizens of our country.
Refugee status is a normal channel of immigration.  There are rules that refugees have to follow to get into the US.  It takes the average refugee 18 month-2 years or more to go through the process to enter the US.  Their case is first reviewed by the UN and then a number of agencies of the US government (state department, FBI, Homeland Security, Defense Dept and Natl counterterrorism center).  Their backgrounds are thoroughly checked.  It that system foolproof?  Of course not.  But it is probably harder for an ISIS member to get into the US as a refugee than it is for them to get a fake European passport and fly into JFK on a commercial flight.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by LizzyNY on Thu Oct 20 2016, 00:21

People can find a million reasons to keep strangers away, but it boils down to NIMBY (not in my backyard). This gut reaction rears its head every time we're asked to accept something unfamiliar- a group home in our neighborhood, a drug treatment center, a homeless shelter  families of a different race or religion moving nearby. Everybody's all enthusiastic about helping whoever it is - as long as it isn't anywhere near them.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by Ramona_ on Thu Oct 20 2016, 05:41

F
ladybugcngc wrote:The security checks do the change the HOSTILE history impose on our nation from that region.  It does not change the truth a Syrian based murderous network claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country.  There are 7 continents and 196 countries surely they have other places they can seek 


So the rest of the world have to solve the problem?
What If it was the other way around? If there was a group in the US who murder and torture everyone who doesn't want to join? And you wanted to run away for it? What would you think If other countries would say: 'no, you're from america, you're a potential murderer. Go seek somewhere else.'

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by carolhathaway on Thu Oct 20 2016, 06:42

Ramona,
I gave you a greenie for your last statement because that's exactly how I feel about it.
The States are so far away, so out of touch when it's about the refugees crisis.

Most of the refugees who came to Europe about a year ago, when it all started, had already spent a lot in refugee camps in their own or a neighboring country, because most of them thought that the conflict would be over in a short time and they would be able to return to their home or hometown. We've seen and read many reports about how refugees were treated in Turkey, Lebanon and other countries who still host millions of refugees. The problem is that they aren't treated as refugees but as guests. So they get no financial support, no medical treatment, no help at all. They live in tents without water and electricity, their kids are not allowed to go to school there. So - at least for me - it's understandable that these people try to escape after a while, because before you run our of money, you have to decide if you want to spend the rest of it there and die after it's gone, you go back to a destroyed hometown and fear to be bombed - or to go somewhere where you are treated as a human being, are safe and have a future for yourself and your family.

And please don't forget that the US foreign policy of the past decades forced the problems and the foundation of ISIS, daesh, Al Qaida etc...

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by ladybugcngc on Thu Oct 20 2016, 07:08

I don't seek to ban Syrians or any immigrant from going through the NORMAL channels of immigration."  


When I state "NORMAL" i'm referring to Syrian NON-REFUGEE status.  




Fava - According to the Department of State the entire process CAN take an average of 18-24 months to complete. Source - https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/overview-us-refugee-law-and-policy


We don't know how long it took to process 10,000 Syrian refugee to enter our country.


The truth is whether it took 1 day or 2 years we know have 10,000 people fleeing a war torn country from a region that has proven to be hostile to the citizens of this country.  A country where a murderous network has claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country.


Explain to me why our elected officials would do that.


Last edited by ladybugcngc on Thu Oct 20 2016, 07:31; edited 1 time in total

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Post by ladybugcngc on Thu Oct 20 2016, 07:14

Ramona_ wrote:F
ladybugcngc wrote:The security checks do the change the HOSTILE history impose on our nation from that region.  It does not change the truth a Syrian based murderous network claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country.  There are 7 continents and 196 countries surely they have other places they can seek 


So the rest of the world have to solve the problem?
What If it was the other way around? If there was a group in the US who murder and torture everyone who doesn't want to join? And you wanted to run away for it? What would you think If other countries would say: 'no, you're from america, you're a potential murderer. Go seek somewhere else.'

If the United States claimed responsibility for mass murder in a country.  I would not expect that country to be dumb enough to let me in let me in as a refugee.  Has ISIS/IS commit mass murder in Holland?

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by fava on Thu Oct 20 2016, 13:52

ladybugcngc wrote:I don't seek to ban Syrians or any immigrant from going through the NORMAL channels of immigration."  


When I state "NORMAL" i'm referring to Syrian NON-REFUGEE status.  




Fava - According to the Department of State the entire process CAN take an average of 18-24 months to complete. Source - https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/overview-us-refugee-law-and-policy


We don't know how long it took to process 10,000 Syrian refugee to enter our country.


The truth is whether it took 1 day or 2 years we know have 10,000 people fleeing a war torn country from a region that has proven to be hostile to the citizens of this country.  A country where a murderous network has claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country.


Explain to me why our elected officials would do that.
Because we have a history and policy and laws to allow legal refugees and those seeking asylum to seek refuge here (regardless of country of origin or religion). Because the vast majority of those refugees are fleeing the "murderous network that has claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country" and who have done much worse in the country these people (50% of whom are women and 385 are children under 11) have fled from.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by party animal - not! on Thu Oct 20 2016, 13:57

Exactly, Fava.

Who would like to see this great interview of Hugh Laurie on the Stephen Colbert show late last night after the debate?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyODq3v64wg

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by ladybugcngc on Thu Oct 20 2016, 14:54

Fava -" Because we have a history and policy and laws to allow legal refugees and those seeking asylum to seek refuge here (regardless of country of origin or religion). Because the vast majority of those refugees are fleeing the "murderous network that has claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country" and who have done much worse in the country these people (50% of whom are women and 385 are children under 11) have fled from."


My response:  That sounds noble; the TRUTH is NEITHER, you, I, nor the people responsible for review can tell the difference between a refugee and a member of ISIS/IS.  
 
The San Bernardino mass murderers were a husband and wife with an infant child.  The fact most of these refugees are women and children do not make us any safer.  History has PROVEN, people in that region once thought of as allies turned out to be foes. 
 
Our elected officials represent the citizens of this country.  I expect them to FIRST take actions that assure the safety of the citizens of this country.  The truth is we now have 10,000 people fleeing a war torn country from a region that has proven to be hostile to the citizens of this country; a country where a murderous network (who hides in plain sight) has claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country. 
 
Please give me an example of any time our history where our elected officials have taken in refugees from a country that has an established murderous network, whom of which hides in plain sight, lay in wait to carry out mass murder, and have claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country.




.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by annemarie on Thu Oct 20 2016, 15:00

That was funny and he is right.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by fava on Thu Oct 20 2016, 15:27

ladybugcngc wrote:Fava -" Because we have a history and policy and laws to allow legal refugees and those seeking asylum to seek refuge here (regardless of country of origin or religion). Because the vast majority of those refugees are fleeing the "murderous network that has claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country" and who have done much worse in the country these people (50% of whom are women and 385 are children under 11) have fled from."


My response:  That sounds noble; the TRUTH is NEITHER, you, I, nor the people responsible for review can tell the difference between a refugee and a member of ISIS/IS.  
 
The San Bernardino mass murderers were a husband and wife with an infant child.  The fact most of these refugees are women and children do not make us any safer.  History has PROVEN, people in that region once thought of as allies turned out to be foes. 
 
Our elected officials represent the citizens of this country.  I expect them to FIRST take actions that assure the safety of the citizens of this country.  The truth is we now have 10,000 people fleeing a war torn country from a region that has proven to be hostile to the citizens of this country; a country where a murderous network (who hides in plain sight) has claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country. 
 
Please give me an example of any time our history where our elected officials have taken in refugees from a country that has an established murderous network, whom of which hides in plain sight, lay in wait to carry out mass murder, and have claimed responsibility for mass murder in our country.




.
Afghanistan.

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ladybugcngc

Post by ladybugcngc on Thu Oct 20 2016, 15:34

Was that under the Bush Administration?  Was that before or after 9/11?  Osama Bin Ladan was an ally turned foe based in Afghanistan.  Thank you for proving my point.

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Re: The Serious Side

Post by ladybugcngc on Thu Oct 20 2016, 16:27

19  write-in candidate hope days remaining.

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Re: The Serious Side

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