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April 2016 Chit Chat

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by carolhathaway on Wed Apr 27 2016, 19:28

I do agree with you on that Bush's attacks in Iraq might just have forced  the foundation of ISIS and didn't cause it. We'll never know it, and I guess we can never make the world a safe and happy place with enough to eat and clean water for the whole world. And yes, we're on the lucky side, live in wealth, have jobs and direct access to all the resources we need.

The one thought which came to my mind was: Did Clapper make these statements NOW to support Trump's politics? I know that that sounds a bit cynical but I just saw Trump's comments after the last primary elections: "When I become president ISIS won't exist any longer."
Because if he'd became president and attacked and fought ISIS / ISIL it would be Europe again where all the people would go to and not the US...


Last edited by carolhathaway on Wed Apr 27 2016, 19:31; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Added text)

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by annemarie on Wed Apr 27 2016, 19:43

Trump is a damn fool and the people who follow him and believe his bull even bigger fools.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by party animal - not! on Wed Apr 27 2016, 20:06

Serious security issues is an understatement, I'm afraid, as was proved after the Brussels atrocity when it became public that the Brussels police force consists of six different branches based on language in some instances, who do not share or exchange information, and where in Molenbeek alone (which is where most of this particular terrorist cell lived) they were understaffed by 200 officers - and this even after what had already happened in Paris.

 Furthermore there was no plan in such an event and no decision had been discussed as to whether the army should be deployed.

And this is where EU headquarters are based! Stunning.

And it was also made known that large number of EU countries (and remember there are 29 of them!) do not have a system of exchanging airline passenger lists.......again given the situation, it seems to take forever to act in what is actually a priority situation. 

As for bringing back border controls, yes, I can why that might seem impractical but several EU countries have managed for short periods of time when necessary, but often it seems that they are acting after the event, rather than taking action beforehand. And to be honest it wasn't that long ago when we did have borders.

Given the warnings that Daesh gave the world in the winter/spring of 2014/2015, and given the build up of refugees on the Syrian/Turkish border and elsewhere has been known about since 2012/13 it sometimes feels to me as if the tanker that is the EU has gone aground! 

And unfortunately the US left Iraq with a mainly Shia government in place, giving the Sunni extremists all sorts of 'justification' to do what they are doing

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by Donnamarie on Wed Apr 27 2016, 20:10

You'll get no argument from me annemarie!

Carol, I do not believe that Clapper made those statements to rally Trump supporters or to bolster Trump.  I would think there are very few military generals (former L. General Air Force) in our armed forces who would ever support Trump.  He would be a disaster for our foreign policy. It was Trump who said he wasn't sure if we might have to use nuclear weapons in the future!


Last edited by Donnamarie on Wed Apr 27 2016, 20:27; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : added text)

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by party animal - not! on Wed Apr 27 2016, 21:47

Clapper was appointed by President Obama..........

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by LizzyNY on Wed Apr 27 2016, 23:47

Carolhathaway - I think Clapper made his statement now because President Obama is visiting heads of state in Europe and this statement might be a calculated move by the president to support a point he's trying to make to them.

Kind of off the topic, but it struck me that we have an advantage over you. The EU is made up of 29 separate and distinct countries, each with its own language, customs and political systems - and any member can leave if they so choose. That must be a very unsettling feeling.

  We have 50 states - each of which might have been a separate country if history had treated us a little differently - but none of them is going anywhere. Each state has its  own local laws and customs, but we are bound by a common language and an overriding federal government which rules all the states.The only time any states tried to secede, we ended up with the Civil War (1863), and even though there is talk of secession occasionally, it is usually on a state or local level and is not taken very seriously.

I'm not sure where I was going with this. It was just a thought that struck me. Maybe it's that we are such a large confederation of states, so intertwined and interdependent that it gives us a sense of stability that a smaller group of nations doesn't have.

I don't know. It appears my train of thought has left the station without me! Very Happy

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by carolhathaway on Thu Apr 28 2016, 07:06

LizzyNY wrote:I don't know. It appears my train of thought has left the station without me! Very Happy

LOL! LOL! LOL!

Lizzy,
this expression is just great!

Yes, you in the U.S. have several advantages compared to us in Europe.
We are so closed together that one country's decision for or against something will always influence the neighboring countries as well, if not the rest of the EU. We just had discussions about the safety of nuclear power stations because there had been several 'incidents' at NPS in Feance and Belgium so Luxemburg and Germany asked them to shut them down. The MP of Luxemburg said: "If any serious incident will happen at one of their NPSs next to our border, our whole country will be gone." (since Luxemburg is a very small country he's probably right). After Fukushima Germany has decided to close down all our NPSs and we've already closed down quite a few. But if an incident happened in any NPS in Europe, it will damage us as well. After Czernobyl we had nuclear fallout for decades, our deers were contaminated until about ten years ago...

And we have so many different languages, political systems and religions that it always seemed a miracle for me that it worked. Now we seem to have a change in that, and I think that the refugees crises is not the reason for that but maybe showed the different positions and difficulties. If a country which had before agreed to help refugees (because they have to do it when applying to joig the EU) now denies to take any refugees, I think we have reached a point where we have to think about the values of the EU. Last week there were negotiations in the EU parliament about how many refugees every country has to take, and there were countries which denied to accept 2 (TWO) per month - for their whole country... For me the EU should at least return irs Nobel Prize for Peace.

But back to topic: I didn't want to insult Mr. Clapper, it was just a thought that came to my mind when I saw the interview with Trump. But if you think about Clapper's interview, the two refugees a European country should accept, could be ISIS / ISIL fighters / sleepers. So it's better to leave them where they are, many of them for years already, no matter what happens to them in refugee camps in Turkey, Jordan or Greece, if children are able to go to school or not, no matter that Greece is still bankrupt...

I couldn't deal with that.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by LizzyNY on Thu Apr 28 2016, 13:10

Carolhathaway - I don't think you insulted Mr. Clapper. What he said was unsettling, but I don't think he meant that we should all close our borders to the refugees. He was IMO, just warning our allies that if your borders are open there is a risk that some terrorists will enter with the refugees and that the EU security forces need to work closely together and not relax their vigilance for a moment.

I think one of the biggest issues in the world today is how much of our freedom we're willing to give up for security. I don't know how we can balance the two concerns and still be the people we want to be.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by carolhathaway on Thu Apr 28 2016, 13:59

LizzyNY wrote:
I think one of the biggest issues in the world today is how much of our freedom we're willing to give up for security. I don't know how we can balance the two concerns and still be the people we want to be.

Lizzy,
you nailed it! I thought for a while how to express, and that's exactly how I feel as well! Thanks for that!

Last year in November a soccer match between Germany and the Netherlands in Hanover was cancelled just about an hour before it was supposed to start (I wrote about it in the November chit chat since my sister was there) due to security concerns, and this caused a lot of questions, especially since the terror attacks in Paris happened while there was a soccer match between France and Germany at the Stade de France and the terrorists had planned to bomb the stadium. So at the press conference after the cancelled match the German minister of interior was asked why the match was cancelled, and he said tgat he can't say that because 'parts of my answer could alienate the Germans'. This really helped to settle everything, we all felt quite relieved after that answer confused

By the way: We were never told why the match was cancelled...


Last edited by carolhathaway on Thu Apr 28 2016, 14:00; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Added text)

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by What Would He Say on Thu Apr 28 2016, 16:15

I'm delayed at an airport because of French Air Traffic Strike. It's a smallish  airport in London and it's getting more and more crowded...pressure has been on security to get ppl through...it's my second flight today and security at the last airport was under similar pressure....a few ppl have walked away abandoning their plans....and some have said fear is the reason....They are unhappy with the pressure on security and decided off their own bat to walk away....

Security has suddenly become something ppl are taking responsibility for themselves....ppl with families mostly have decided not to carry on....

To a degree it shows we are securing ourselves and not expecting others to do the work for us....I admire those who have said "no! Ain't putting my kids through this" for the sake of a holiday or visit to relations ...They lose money but gain my respect.....I travel alone and only have me to look after....Even then I am awArr of not doing anything stupid that could put a stranger at pointless risk...     

The world has changed and ppl are at last cottoning on to what's happening....

It almost seems in direct and equal amounts to the freedom Lizzy talks of loosing that We have no problem compromising our security on Facebook or Twitter ... For no good reason.....

In a perfect world maybe the words private and personal would not be dirty anymore....

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by LizzyNY on Thu Apr 28 2016, 17:10

WWHS - I am one of those Luddites who don't put their lives on social media. If you have something to tell me you can contact me directly by phone or email - or if it isn't urgent you can mail me an announcement or even  affraid write me a letter! I don't have time to check out everyone's social media pages all the time. COH is the only site I make time for every day. Smile 

With all the advances being made in technology, hopefully it won't be long before something will be developed to make traveling safer and less stressful. Safe travels. I hope the rest of your trip goes smoothly. Good luck! flower

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by What Would He Say on Fri Apr 29 2016, 12:05

Your better off Lizzy, keep Ludditing I say...

I was trying to make the point that the more this "social" media thing kicks in the more compromised national and international security becomes.....Almost as if the Gods are trying to teach us a lesson...one more reality show and the viewers will be turned to pillars of salt....

It's all gone too far, people using "likes" and "fans" as personal petrol....we have become fuel for the ego and vanity of others...

F*** your birth certificate, if you haven't been "tagged" your nobody....You will never reach the nirvana of being a Hashtag...

Yesterday I was stuck in a really tight space far too small for the amount of ppl....NO one shouted or protested....several filmed it and sent it to their Facebook page....

People are caring more about what other people think of their experience....rather than any flame that might be licking their butt or any lack of oxygen in a tight space....The last rights have been replaced by the last post....

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by Donnamarie on Fri Apr 29 2016, 13:05

Seems to me people are far more interested in documenting their lives than actually living in the moment. I notice it all the time.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by LizzyNY on Fri Apr 29 2016, 13:25

IMO, when people look back at this time in history, Mark Zuckerberg and Apple will have a lot to answer for. Between Facebook and IPhones we've destroyed a generation's ability to function in the real world. It may be good for the tech sector, but I wonder how good it ultimately will be for the rest of us.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by Donnamarie on Fri Apr 29 2016, 13:58

Well I see the burden of responsibility on us. Not the innovators as much. We have choices in how we lead our personal lives. Tech devices are great and they have their place. People need to find a balance in how they allow these devices to manipulate their everyday lives.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by Donnamarie on Fri Apr 29 2016, 14:03

On a much darker note, for what it's worth when is Assad going to be brought up on international war crimes charges?! His government has killed over 180,000 of his own people. Latest assault on a Doctors Without Borders' hospital in Aleppo.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by PigPen on Sat Apr 30 2016, 16:01

Lizzy... as with all things, who's put a gun to the heads of millions-no, make that baziillions of people, and forced them to get involved with social media?   I understand your point. Truly.    Did people say the same thing about the invention of the telephone?   It's all in the way things are used.  It's like saying the makers of oxycotin are responsible for an increase in drug addiction-when in fact it was developed to help terminal cancer patients.  Anything can be abused.  Or used in a way not intended. 

We need to stop playing the part of the victim and be responsible for our actions, and that includes teens.  Real tired of the "but it's not my fault" line.

End of rant.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by LizzyNY on Sat Apr 30 2016, 17:38

PP - Totally agree, but also think that just like it's the media that put Trump where he is today because they just couldn't stop covering him, the tech companies and their marketing arms have inundated us with the ""need" to be plugged in to the latest device and trend. They especially target the most vulnerable consumers - young people and teens, who live to "fit in".

We will figure out how to use social media and technology without it consuming our lives, but it's going to take time and I think that for some the damage has already been done.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by annemarie on Sat Apr 30 2016, 18:31

There are actually adults who live for social media it is crazy to me. People have lost the ability to talk to each other you can call someone on your phone but instead you text. Skills that you need are being lost like spelling and writing.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by it's me on Sat Apr 30 2016, 19:49

NI
100 !



She is 100 years old young ! Very Happy

http://www.repubblica.it/spettacoli/people/2016/04/30/foto/vogue_compie_un_secolo_modella_di_100_anni_in_copertina-138809930/1/?ref=HRESS-1#7



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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by LornaDoone on Sat Apr 30 2016, 22:07

it's me wrote:NI
100 !



She is 100 years old young ! Very Happy

http://www.repubblica.it/spettacoli/people/2016/04/30/foto/vogue_compie_un_secolo_modella_di_100_anni_in_copertina-138809930/1/?ref=HRESS-1#7




His name is Bo Gilbert, is 100 years old, and Vogue has chosen it for the cover of the English edition in June to celebrate the first centenary of the magazine. '' I like to take care of myself, look decent even if I'm not coming out. I try to maintain high '' standard, explains Bo in the hype created by Harvey Nichols, chain of shopping malls English. '' Our aim is to demonstrate that even generations later with age can be fashionable without having to fear '', explained the creative director Ben Tollet.

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by it's me on Sat Apr 30 2016, 22:30

Thanks for translation Thumbs up!

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

Post by melbert on Sun May 01 2016, 04:52

Lovely lady!

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Re: April 2016 Chit Chat

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