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Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

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Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Nicky80 on Thu Apr 24 2014, 19:32

Google translation


Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

The headline on the website of SVT sound dramatically : "Once again Russian bomber exercises over Sweden ," headlined the public television station , which is even understated . In the text concretized Anders Persson , tactical commander of the Swedish Air Force, that the Russians - two bombers and three accompanying aircraft - had one hour simulated air attacks. And not just on the southern tip of Sweden , but also in Poland and the Baltic states .

The incident occurred in mid-November 2013. As with the recent incident in which two Russian long-range bombers had approached the airspace of the Netherlands and Great Britain rose to interceptors , in this case the type JAS39 Saab " Gripen " . Such actions, it is in the Cold War and afterwards come again and again. Normally, several cases per year are alone publicly known , an unknown number of other incidents is likely to end up in the archives of the military.

- In April 2012, flew a Russian Tupolev -95 bomber over the North Atlantic. Four states - the UK, Belgium , Norway and Denmark were Euro Fighter and F -16 fighter jets ascend to observe the Russians out of the area.

- In June 2013 Russia led by the same two exercises on the border of Finnish airspace. Here, too, rose to interceptors . The Defense Ministry in Helsinki accused Russia then to have violated the Finnish airspace. Moscow denied .

- According to the Government of Lithuania to Russian aircraft approaching now every week the Lithuanian air space in a way that interceptors must restart .

The effect of these actions showed an example of an incident at Easter , 2013, when the Russian air force flew attack near the uninhabited Swedish Baltic island Gotska Sandon . A Swedish response was made ​​or came too late , though actually an alarm rotting of two interceptors should always be ready to start. Within the armed forces of the country which led to a debate about its ability to air defense , SVT reported . Therefore, were used in the re- simulated attack in November 2013 interceptor . "We wanted to show that we are paying attention ," said Persson .

Probably reconnaissance technology on board of Russian aircraft

Thus, the Russians could have achieved one of their goals : to find out how prepared the defense air forces of other states are . " When approaching bombers the airspace of a country , of course, is clear to all that they may be seen ," says a former German army officer and fighter pilot told SPIEGEL ONLINE. "So on the one hand a military muscle flexing , on the other hand also more than that "

Presumably , the ex- pilot , located on board the Russian bomber technique for detecting signal reconnaissance , called in military jargon Sigint ( Signals Intelligence ) . In this example, the radio communications or the positions of radar and air defense of a potential opponent are captured. The more one approaches its airspace , the deeper you can see into it. "Before, you needed to Special aircraft that were easily recognizable as such ," said the ex - pilot . " But today you can accommodate appropriate specialist equipment and in the interior of another aircraft. "

If the Russians collect such information , but that's nothing unusual. "For the armed forces of a country it is always interesting to know how an opponent reacts to a threat , how fast he does it and in what form ," said the former officer. Military always tried to be prepared for all eventualities.

" German Army pilots knew by heart attack targets in the East "

This is also true for Western forces. " During the Cold War finished plans for air strikes have always been in the drawer ," says the former fighter pilot . "As a pilot for Germany had to potential targets in the East know by heart . " Also one is like flying at high speed in the air surveillance zone along the German - German border. "We've only done to show that we can. "

The Russians could in practice in November 2013, had the same aim in mind , as well as the Swedish Air Force officer Persson suggested : " I think they wanted to show that they can perform this kind of action . " However, there was a significant difference between Sweden and Russia: " When we practice , we do this together with another nation and not looking for us targets on the territory of other States . "

NATO reacted promptly to the bomber holds: Next week the UK wants to send four Euro Fighter Jets to Lithuania , to strengthen the NATO air defense in the Baltics. In addition to four Danish F -16 fighter aircraft will be stationed in Estonia. Usually, the NATO has four aircraft for monitoring in the Baltic States, as of next week it then twelve .


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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by LizzyNY on Fri Apr 25 2014, 00:55

Deja vu to WWII. Putin seems to want to expand Russia into any place where anyone speaks Russian. Maybe he'll want Alaska back next.( If they take Sarah Palin with it, they can have it!) Or maybe he'll want the Brighton Beach neighborhood of Brooklyn, NY.  Smile 

Seriously, this is such irresponsible and reckless behavior on the part of a "world leader". Isn't there enough warmongering in the world? And this idiot just got a Peace Priize? Maybe they should make him give it back. That might get his attention, as nothing else seems to.

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Mazy on Fri Apr 25 2014, 02:18

These things were decided some time ago:
And this idiot just got a Peace Priize? Maybe they should make him give it back. That might get his attention, as nothing else seems to.
I'm starting to think that he has a very narcissistic personality like Hitler did. He seems to be getting more erratical. I agree Lizzy he can have Palin with my worse regards.

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by LornaDoone on Fri Apr 25 2014, 04:09

If Putin doesn't stop fucking with the Jews in Ukraine I'm sure Mossad will be happy to give him the Jimmy Hoffa treatment.  And I don't think many nations around Russia will be shedding any tears.  JMO

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by LizzyNY on Fri Apr 25 2014, 04:58

@Lorna - If only! Unfortunately, it would probably only make the Israeli situation worse. They have enough enemies already. I wonder what the world reaction would be if the situation in Ukraine caused the Jewish population to try and leave like they did in Europe before WWII. Would everyone turn a blind eye again until it's too late?

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Katiedot on Fri Apr 25 2014, 05:42

Russian surveillance plane tried to fly into British air space the day before yesterday: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Picachu on Fri Apr 25 2014, 05:56

Have they not done that the last couple of years?, at least our military are on the case to protect us

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Nicky80 on Fri Apr 25 2014, 07:42

Kind of scary that Putin is not afraid doing that as Russia has done it now few times with different airspace. Europe is staying very calm for now 

Is this the silence before the bing bang?....Scary

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Nicky80 on Fri Apr 25 2014, 07:46

LizzyNY wrote:@Lorna - If only! Unfortunately, it would probably only make the Israeli situation worse. They have enough enemies already. I wonder what the world reaction would be if the situation in Ukraine caused the Jewish population to try and leave like they did in Europe before WWII. Would everyone turn a blind eye again until it's too late?

Not everyone Lizzy...They were many groups who tried to help and fight Hitler. Even in Germany. You can't generalize "everyone".... Just saying.....

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Carla97 on Fri Apr 25 2014, 08:19

Nicky80 wrote:Kind of scary that Putin is not afraid doing that as Russia has done it now few times with different airspace. Europe is staying very calm for now 

Is this the silence before the bing bang?....Scary

I wouldn´t read too much into this… he has violated other countries (Sweden, Finland, Estonia, Poland…) airspaces as far as I can remember for years quite regular bases. What can you expect from a professional spy?

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by LizzyNY on Fri Apr 25 2014, 17:18

@Nicky - I'm not saying that millions of people everywhere didn't try to fight Hitler - they did, and thank God they succeeded! But most governments turned a blind eye to the people trying to escape the Nazi onslaught, refusing to let them in, leaving them to their fate. They had all kinds of reasons but the end result was the same - millions died.

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by LizzyNY on Fri Apr 25 2014, 17:24

The failure of the world to do more to rescue the victims of WWII, imo, is a big reason for so much humanitarian effort today. That feeling of "never again" fuels people like George and John Prendergast, Bono and Angelina Jolie and many others to do what they can when governments are slow or unwilling to respond. We didn't do enough before, we should do as much as we can now.

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Atalante on Fri Apr 25 2014, 21:01

... MEN ... & their wargames, oh gosh, vote them out of politics !!! They can't run one household, so what makes them think they can run millions !

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Mazy on Fri Apr 25 2014, 23:44

LizzyNY wrote:The failure of the world to do more to rescue the victims of WWII, imo, is a big reason for so much humanitarian effort today. That feeling of "never again" fuels people like George and John Prendergast, Bono and Angelina Jolie and many others to do what they can when governments are slow or  unwilling to respond. We didn't do enough before, we should do as much as we can now.

@LIZZY The sad part is we have not learned our lesson as a whole. The world has turned a blind eye too many times and is still doing it. Look at Syria, Darfur,(well hell most of Africa) we can go on and on. As a community (The World) how can we sit back a literally watch flesh and blood human beings being slaughtered like cattle. These poor people have souls; it is not man's right to take another's life unless in a legitimate war. We only have so many Georges, Bonos, Angelinas Brads and so on. Look how much garbage they get for "being a goodie" whatever.

Saying that sometimes a few have to take control to save the many:
@Lorna If done the same, and memory serves me, not only they never found him but no one ever got charged with his disappearance. Sometimes when things happen prier to an onslaught it saves many lives.

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by LizzyNY on Sat Apr 26 2014, 00:20

@Mazy - The problem isn't whether to do something, but rather, what to do. When South Sudan finally became an independent country there was much hope that the people there could finally see a life without threat of violence from Sudan. Al Bashir must be laughing his ass off now that the South Sudanese are killing each other.

I know much of this violence comes from allocation of scarce resources, but this is a problem that is only going to get worse. If we believe the scientists, global warming is going to affect all of us because of climate change. We're already seeing the weather affecting crop yields, which will affect food prices and availabillity everywhere. This is more than a political problem.

If everyone everywhere had enough to live decently there would be no problem, but that will never happen. Figuring out how to share resources is the major task that faces the world, imo, and it will not happen easily.

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Mazy on Sat Apr 26 2014, 01:53

@Lizzy what you are saying is mostly true. What I am saying is go the way Lorna said or the higher ranking governments get together and make a stronger stand or before we know it Putin will be like another Hitler or whoever.

I also feel that much more could/should have been done in Africa's troubled areas. Birshir's Genocide has been going on for ten years the south breaking away didn't change that.

I am also afraid that Pres Obama's lack of fortitude on the matter might also affect the 2016 election whether it be Hilary or not. I am an Obama supporter I belong to OFA group get his emails daily; glad that Romney didn't get in; but I am disappointed with him on some issues, normal. However, his lack of help for Darfur is a big thing, and you know if you go around the different news sources on the internet; I'm not alone. (Hows that for a run-on?)

What I'm saying is we dropped the ball as did many other countries; and we had better pick it up again and get it back in the game. Because what happens in any part of the world will come to our door one day. Especially in these times when the world is getting smaller in terms of touching each other. & IT'S THE RIGHT THING TO DO.

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by LizzyNY on Sat Apr 26 2014, 02:22

Mazy - I totally agree with everything you said. I'm only wondering WHAT the solution could be. Yes, we have to put Putin in his place before he starts another war. And, yes, we have to help the victims of violence. The question is HOW?

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

Post by Carla97 on Sat Apr 26 2014, 08:22

What can be done?

At least we can watch realtime how planes are flying here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I took a look and by clicked randomly one plane, it gives you info about the type of plane, speed, where it is from and destination etc. Except that it didn´t there was a plane in Ukraine that had none of it, in the air just a minut a go.

Also if you click airports, it gives timetables of arrivals. Interesting, that city like Simferopol has so many planes coming from moscow.  Concentrating 

Too bad none followed the malesian plane from here...

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Re: Russian bombers over Europe : Putin's flying provocateurs

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