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US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

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US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by LornaDoone on Thu Oct 10 2013, 03:39

http://tv.msnbc.com/2013/10/09/poll-republicans-are-almost-all-to-blame-for-shutdown/


Congress approval rating plummets to 5%

MSNBC Online
Michele Richinick, @mrich1201
11:55 AM on 10/09/2013

Americans’ approval of Congress, most notably the GOP, hit a second all-time low within two weeks as the government closure continues.

Just 5% said they support the decisions being made by government leaders, while a whopping 83% disapprove, according to the Associated Press-GfK poll released Wednesday.

A mere 10% of the public reportedly approved of Congress hours before the shutdown began last week. The rate was the smallest percent in history that favored Congress, as of Oct. 1.

Sixty-two percent of the public believes Republicans are “almost all/a lot” to blame for the current government shutdown. President Obama and Democrats both received 49% of the criticism, followed by House Speaker John Boehner with 48%, the Tea Party with 43%, and Sen. Harry Reid with 39%.

Republicans again earned a 17%-approval rating from Americans, the same number from the Quinnipiac University poll conducted last week. Seventy percent of the public disapproves of the party now, down from 74%.

And just 23% of the country favors Democrats, a decline since the party’s rating stood at 32% last Tuesday. Sixty-two percent disapprove.

Americans even favored such usual unappealing topics—witches, zombies, jury duty, hipsters, Wall Street, the DMC, and the IRS—over Congress, according to a survey released Tuesday by the left-leaning Public Policy Polling. The government body tied with cockroaches and toenail fungus, but beat the controversial pop-icon Miley Cyrus.

Related: Congress less popular than dog poop, more so than Miley Cyrus, twerking

The president on Tuesday suggested a short-term truce, asking Republicans to vote to reopen the government and raise the debt ceiling as long-term negotiations continue. But Boehner affirmed that won’t happen.

In turn, 53% of the people surveyed disapprove of Obama’s job dealing with the shutdown. The country agreed that both the president and Republicans aren’t cooperating “enough” with each other. Fifty-two percent said Obama needs to negotiate more, and 63% reported Republicans needing to do so.
The Onion had an interesting theory about that 5% who approve of Congress!


Psychiatrists Deeply Concerned For 5% Of Americans Who Approve Of Congress
News in Brief • Politics • politicians • mental health • ISSUE 49•41 • Oct 9, 2013

WASHINGTON—Noting that the individuals in question may be extremely mentally disturbed or suffering from a serious psychological illness, the nation’s psychiatrists announced Wednesday that they are deeply concerned for the estimated 5 percent of Americans who were found in nationwide polls this week to approve of the U.S. Congress.

“With numerous members of Congress refusing to negotiate an end to the shutdown in the face of widespread federal furloughs and a looming deadline to avoid defaulting on government debt, we are extremely concerned for the mental health of those Americans who responded, ‘Yes, we think Congress is doing a good job,’” psychiatrist Dr. Donald Levin said in a press conference this morning, telling reporters that the estimated 15.5 million Americans who approve of Congress are likely “very troubled” citizens who may in fact be experiencing psychotic episodes or delusional thoughts.

“We’re not entirely sure who these people are or where they come from—perhaps they are psych ward patients, or unstable recluses living in remote huts on the outskirts of society—but what we do know is that they are extremely disconnected from reality and in need of immediate attention if they are not already receiving it.

We need to find these people and get them the help they need before their illnesses get worse.” Psychiatrists added that because a number of mental health services are currently furloughed, many respondents would just have to “sit tight and hang in there” until the shutdown is resolved.

(And for those unaware - The Onion is a parody publication - but damn if they're not getting closer and closer to the truth!)
http://www.theonion.com/articles/psychiatrists-deeply-concerned-for-5-of-americans,34163/


Last edited by LornaDoone on Thu Oct 10 2013, 05:45; edited 1 time in total

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by LornaDoone on Thu Oct 10 2013, 05:05

Some added notes:

I'm currently watching the third episode of Season 1 of Newsroom.

They're covering the last elections.

The anchor tries to ask a Tea Party winner of a seat in Congress if he would vote to raise the debt ceiling.

The newly elected Congressman spews the tea party line that he will not vote to raise any more debt, woefully unaware that's not what the debt ceiling does.  The anchor notes along with the economic commentator that the newly elected tea party members AND the people who voted for them don't understand what the debt ceiling is.


And now 2013 the US has reached the point that the show scarily pointed out.  The tea party members are arguing they will not raise the debt ceiling and showing they absolutely have NO CLUE what the ramifications of that will be.

But on the other hand, Congress has the ability to decrease spending they just haven't done it and I blame BOTH sides of the aisle on this one.

One comment that was clear on an article I read was that what causes debt to increase is Congressional spending that outpaces authorized Congressional tax revenues.

...the debt ceiling does not raise the debt or authorize additional spending, but instead enables the U.S. government to finance existing legal obligations.

This is where the tea party folks get confused.  They think raising the debt ceiling means we going to get more debt.  No, it's to finance existing obligations.

Over the years, Congress has passed a series of laws that set tax rules and spending policies. When the amount the government spends under those laws is higher than the amount of taxes the government brings in, it has to borrow money to fund the difference. The accumulated past deficits add up to the total debt.

But there's another law that puts a legal cap on the amount of debt the U.S. Treasury can issue. So even though the debt is just a residual of all those past tax and spending decisions, it has to be passed as well.

Another tricky part of this issue is the 14th Amendment to the Constitution.  And these tea party folks are NOT aware that either!

The Purpose of the Fourteenth Amendment

The U.S. government passed the 14th amendment on June 13, 1866, and states ratified it on July 9, 1868 – although none of the southern states supported it at the time. It was one of three amendments to the Constitution that were passed in the wake of the Civil War.

The United States passed the 14th Amendment to ensure that the Civil Rights Act, also passed in 1866, would be upheld. The main purpose of the Civil Rights Act was to guarantee recently freed slaves would acquire full rights as citizens of the United States.

Section 4 of the 14th Amendment states:

The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.

Section 4 was enacted after the Civil War because it was feared that some Southern legislators would vote to prevent the United States from paying bills incurred in putting down the confederacy.


Can Obama Act Alone? Some Say ‘Yes, He Can’

Some constitutional experts believe the president has the inherent power to act alone in an emergency – and that the United States defaulting on its bills would constitute such an emergency.

Although the United States specifically enacted section 4 to prevent a very specific occurrence that might have resulted in the aftermath of the Civil War, the language makes no reference to its purpose. It is drafted broadly and it can be argued the words, “The validity of the public debt of the United States…shall not be questioned,” gives the president the constitutional power to pay the country’s debts even if Congress refuses to do so.

Some have suggested that President Obama can simply direct to Treasury to continue to sell bonds so the debts can be paid.

Others argue the president could justify acting alone under his duty to faithfully execute the laws of the United States that includes the Fourteenth Amendment.

Still others theorize that the House, by not agreeing to increase the debt-ceiling, are acting in breach of Section 4; The debt has to be paid and they are “questioning” the process of paying the debt.
So essentially, some might argue that Congress is not upholding the Constitution by holding the country hostage over Obamacare and not voting to raise the debt ceiling.

And some could argue that if President Obama doesn't unilaterally raise the debt ceiling he too is not upholding the Constitution which all members of Congress, Senate and the President were sworn to do.


Info on the 14th Amendment found at this link here:  http://www.decodedscience.com/14th-amendment-can-obama-unilaterally-raise-debt-ceiling/37986

_________

Oh and I should have noted, why does the rest of the world give a flying fuck about all this?  

Well take China for instance. Wait let me back up to make it simple.

Those of us of a certain age may remember when we were kids getting savings bonds as birthday or holiday gifts.

Your mom or dad paid $10 for a bond that in, let's say 10 years, would be worth $15.

And that bond was bought from the US Treasury with a guaranteed return - meaning when that bond came due there would be no quibbling about how much you were owed and whether or not the Treasury would pay you that $15 dollars.

So let's say that savings bond was bought in 2003.  Now that PAST debt that was incurred ten years ago now comes due this year and damn it you know you are owed $15 dollars by the US government and they'd better pay up when you go to cash in that bond!

But now the US government is saying, well, wait a minute, by law we're not allowed to SELL anymore bonds that would pay YOU your $15 dollars (i.e. raising the debt ceiling by allowing the Treasury to sell bonds to pay that 10 year old debt). so maybe we'll have to default on paying you that $15 dollars we promised to pay you 10 years ago.

So what do you say to that?  You paid $10 ten years ago, the US government backed up that purchase with their guarantee that they would pay you $15 in 2013 but the tea party folks are saying - NOPE we're not going to let the Treasury sell any more bonds (i.e. raise how much debt it can issue) to pay you back cause we don't like Obamacare so we're not going to vote to let the Treasury sell bonds so that they can pay you.  And on top of that, we're not going to cut any pork spending from current stuff we've voted on and that was voted on in the past.  (As the infamous 30 stamp their feet like 3 year old children!)

So this has to be resolved by October 17th (or at least the debt ceiling has to be raised by then or the US might start defaulting on its payments).

See now why the Chinese are pissed?  As of January 2013 China owns the third largest amount of US debt - $1.2 TRILLION dollars in US debt - about 8% of the total US debt.

Other large foreign holders of U.S. debt include Japan, which owns $912 billion; the United Kingdom, which owns $347 billion; Brazil, which holds $211 billion; Taiwan, which holds $153 billion; and Hong Kong, which owns $122 billion.

Okay so maybe you're one of those tea party members that frankly could give a flying fuck about China.

But wait it gets even better.  About 32% of the US debt is owed to trust funds for things like Social Security and other things like retirement accounts.  

So what cracks me up is all these tea party constituents who are of Social Security age voting for Tea Party candidates who are vowing NOT to allow the US to pay their debts.  So if the government defaults will they pay out that Social Security check you've been living on?  And what about that retirement money you're owed?  How are you going to pay your bills?

See this is what happens when people vote based on rhetoric and not on educating themselves on what they are voting for and finding out who truly is funding your party.  

Goes to show you - stupid is as stupid does!


Last edited by LornaDoone on Thu Oct 10 2013, 05:42; edited 1 time in total

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by Maggy on Thu Oct 10 2013, 05:19

Neutral 

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by Carla97 on Thu Oct 10 2013, 11:10

Well, Great question.

I don´t have answers. But two points:

1. There has been (and likely will be) high re-election rate for members of Congress (look at historical stats). So this is a Congress (individuals there) that people have selected. And now they do not like the congress as a whole. Oh well...you get what you order.

2. Will there be first-ever U.S. default next week? To my understanding (I can be wrong) there is more to the books than government can handle. In other words US is broke and needs to borrow more money. I don´t think they can default the debt even if they wanted to.

Ugly truth and very original idea. What they need to do is live with balanced budget like any ordinary person have to do in their everyday lives! It means they have to cut spending. How do you formulate that to the voters? Ouch!

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by LornaDoone on Thu Oct 10 2013, 14:16

Well those are very good points.

Because once someone gets something from the government they surely don't want to give it up.

But there are things we could do.

For instance, cut military spending on things like highly technical weapons that we will never use in our lifetimes or in several lifetimes.  But wait, if you cut that spending do you cut jobs to?

And cut funding to large government contractors like Haliburton.  How do you do that, well you pull our soldiers out of manufactured wars!  

That asshole ex Vice President with a gun who can't aim for shit, Cheney's Haliburton, made over $39 BILLION dollars off the US Government.  On top of that the sleaze bucket had some SERIOUS conflict of interest issues.

http://www.cs.cornell.edu/gries/howbushoperates/haliburton.html


Cut subsidies like the farm bill subsidies to large CORPORATE farms.  Not the mom and pop farms, but the corporate farms.  Stop growing food that you're not going to use! I noticed the farm bill cut funding for food stamps but hell those corporate farmers still got theirs.

Cut subsidies to oil companies that have been seeing record profits.  Really, we need to give oil companies a break even though they're already raking in billions and billions of dollars each year?

As to voting.  Well you're correct about that.  WE voted for this and WE as a whole didn't do good due diligence when we voted.  

Plus these tea party members who thought they were joining a "grassroots independent party" made up of folks who paid "$1 or $10 or what they could afford" to fund these candidates had NO clue that major contributors to tea party candidates were the Koch Brothers.  

Two MULTI BILLIONAIRES who could not give a shit about all these idealists who thought they were joining an ALTERNATE party aimed at lowering taxes for all.  

Koch brothers don't give a shit about your taxes.  They only give a shit about THEIR taxes, THEIR subsidies, THEIR influence in Congress and the Senate so that they can continue to rake in record profits to put in THEIR own bank accounts.

I have no respect for the Tea Party because they're people with idealistic goals but no fucking clue of who is pulling their strings.  And then they spout off shit that they read that comes out from organizations that are also funded by the Koch brothers.

Like I said, stupid is as stupid does.

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by party animal - not! on Thu Oct 10 2013, 14:29

Great Lorna! Please sign up to be a politician PDQ and bang the odd head together

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by LornaDoone on Thu Oct 10 2013, 14:32

Oh don't tempt me but really, I only know what I know because I READ. I just wish these idiots in Congress would do the same.

Even better, I wish people who vote would spend a little more time searching for this type of info instead of surfing for porn or seeing which Kardasian is doing what to whom lately or spending hours on end playing video games about stealing cars.

Sigh

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by party animal - not! on Thu Oct 10 2013, 15:08

Couldn't agree with you more Lorna. The same here - and it's worrying when the most read paper in the land is the former News of the World (otherwise known as the News of the Screws) now titled changed by Murdoch to the Sunday Sun.

Oh, and Halliburton, yes. Now am I right in thinking that they got all the oil pipe contracts in Irag post war?..........Mm, strange that.....

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by Carla97 on Thu Oct 10 2013, 20:02

HAL is rallying today, and that´s not strange. Market moves with the Fed not the goverment shutdown. Living on the stimulus. Jep. Only if the fed started to unwind stimulus program the market would tank tank tank.... Very Happy no I´m not smiling, it´s been exhausting day Crying or Very sad 

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by LornaDoone on Thu Oct 10 2013, 21:01

News of the Screws - now that's funny! Thanks for the laugh.

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

Post by Carla97 on Fri Oct 11 2013, 07:33

LoL I guess raising the debt ceiling is a good heavy lifting idea...yesterday was the 2nd best day at the market for this year. Unbelievable.

About the debate, it has slightly wrong focus. Yes it´s about domestic politics, and no it´s not all about that. Key player is China. It is presented as a country, which has taken a risk here, 'putting all the eggs' in the same basket (over $1.2 trillion in bonds, according to the Treasury.)

Chinese have one party system, effective one. Hard to imagine they are interested in who´s sucking who´s teabag in US. Also they have the best brains in the world working on this...so what about the large and ever growing amount of US debt they own? They bought it to ensure their own growth, which has been phenomenal. What was the price for the growth? Maybe, just maybe it was cheap and now on the top of everything, they are waiting to get interest (US to pay back) for the investment. Could the growth have happened any other way in such a short time? No.

Smile

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Re: US Congress Approval Rating at an All Time Low Just 5% And what the heck is all that debt ceiling talk about???

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